CPS failure symptoms? - Page 2

Gary - K7GLD · 05-17-2006, 02:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob4x4

Be prepared to find a small torx bit...........and have a magnet handy so you don't risk loosing the bolt.

Bob

Mine was a plain 'ol hex head...

RStacy · 10-14-2006, 10:39 PM

I'm no expert on here or anything-fact is I'm having alot of the same symptoms your having (were?) -heres the deal-I just dropped about 4 k into mine, among those things were a new vp and a new lift pump- (midwest) I replaced the pumps myself and had everything else done so the truck would be right for my vacation. I know you guys are in depth so I'll explain the entire situation-I live in the mountains of Asheville NC. I was on vaca. to HHI-the beach-(altitude). My problems started the next day. the truck stumbled and died while idling with the ac on. It restarted (long start) and skipped only once during the rest of the week-progressively it has gotten worse.

here are the symptoms currently-truck runs fine, good pick-up while cold. as it gets warmer the tach will drop to zero at lower speeds and stay there. I lose about half power. when idling the truck has idled rough and died a couple of times.

anytime it dies I go through the long start process. at 60 mph or better the tach works properly and power returns.

I also ran a tank of b20 Bio through the system-lots of extra power-I then ran the b99.9 through and was equally pleased with the ower/fuel increase.

I'm back on petro-diesel now until I figure this out. Any advice is greatly appreciated.

I thought this might be helpful because I just replaced my pumps and am having very similar issues. Could be a timing issue on my part though-I didn't reset any timing-just left it where it was. it was at the one o'clock and it was supposed to go in at 12 I think. The pump turned freely and so I moved it and inch to line up properly.

Gary - K7GLD · 10-15-2006, 02:59 AM

WELL, I've swapped in a new VP-44 since this thread was started - agonized over whether or not to swap out the CPS - finally did not. I *did* remove the old CPS and unplugged it's cable, sprayed everything vigorously with contact cleaner, and simply reinstalled it.

The II rebuilt replacement VP has never yet delivered up any code of any kind - just as it should be...

BUT, last week I sent in my original VP-44 to II that I had removed because of the 216 - they gave me a call wanting to know why I had sent it to them because in their initial test stand check, there were NO error codes registered in the VP-44 control board, and it was functioning perfectly!

All I could do, was instruct them to make further tests, replace anything that needed it (if they could isolate it!), and send it back when they were satisfied it was as good as new.

SO, what if they DON'T find anything wrong with it?

Is it even remotely possible there WAS a connection problem with the CPS - and that my cleaning it's contacts is what REALLY stopped the 216's - and NOT the VP-44 swap-out?

Sure wish I knew - maybe what II finally comes up with will solve the mystery - or not...

RStacy · 10-15-2006, 11:47 PM

That's interesting-mine blew some oil out around the area the cps is in. I guess that is the next thing to check. I also am interested in the clutch fan thermo. hit or miss right? lol.

rweis · 10-16-2006, 02:46 PM

I get the impression that the CPS integrates with the VP44 calculations. I also think that the CPS signals are involved with telling the ECM what to do with the LP (start voltage or run voltage).

When my VP44 threw 0216's the conditions were very high rpm conditions (3000 rpm +), and "normal" engine temperature (fully up to operating temperature). In DC's "repair" scheme, they "fixed" (replaced) the lp first, then "fixed" (replaced) the CPS second, before "fixing" (replacing) the VP44 (a Jan 2002 VP44).

I think DC does a corporate cost effective (and I do not mean correct) RnR approach to "repair", not necessarily a customer satisfaction approach to repair. That said I think if the CPS is in the DC list of "things to do", then I would certainly replace the CPS just because it is a relatively innexpensive part (as compared to a VP44) and directly inputs to the VP44.

my .02

RStacy · 10-16-2006, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary - K7GLD

Mine was a plain 'ol hex head...

Did you change it with the vp in place or removed? I started looking at it today-tight fit.

Gary - K7GLD · 10-17-2006, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RStacy

Did you change it with the vp in place or removed? I started looking at it today-tight fit.

I was swapping out the VP-44, and pulled out the CPS while the VP was out, just outta curiosity and to check for visual problems - looked fine externally, so thoroughly applied contact cleaner to plug contacts and reinstalled it. I'd sure prefer to NOT have to change one out with the VP-44 in place!

Timbeaux38 · 10-17-2006, 06:32 PM

I swapped mine out withthe VP44 in. I was having the same problems as described in post #17. I am a small fella and it was a bear with my small hands. Getting it out was the easy part, but lining up the screw and getting it tight caused a nice cussin' fit. The sensor is cheap, and it should be replaced anytime you have the pump out wether you need it or not IMO

Jetson · 10-17-2006, 08:26 PM

RStacy, the 1999's run primarily off the Crankcase Position Sensor (CKP), but they also have a Cam Position Sensor (CMP). If you're loosing the tach, you probably have a bad CKP.

Gary - K7GLD · 10-17-2006, 09:18 PM

Quote:

The sensor is cheap, and it should be replaced anytime you have the pump out wether you need it or not IMO

The problem for me was more related to availablity than cost - it's a 250 mile round trip from here to where they MIGHT have the proper sensor - so sometimes we either have to wait - and that was no option in my situation - or else take yer chances...

So far, all is well - and about 3000 miles on the replacement VP-44...

Willys · 05-18-2007, 02:38 PM

Gary, any updates on how your VP is doing? Has the 216 code come back?

Gary - K7GLD · 05-18-2007, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Willys

Gary, any updates on how your VP is doing? Has the 216 code come back?

AH, a thread from the past!

No more problems - replaced my OEM VP-44 with a II rebuilt, all is well. As to the CPS, removed it, visually checked - waste of time, since there's really nothing external to check other than obvious damage - but did clean the plug end contacts with contact cleaner and reinstalled. I'm really not much inclined to swap out properly working parts just because I "happen to be in the area" - it would be just my luck to replace a good one with one defective right outta the box!

Besides, there's really not much in a CPS to fail - it's a simple magnetic sensor - a metal core with wire windings around it to sense tone wheel teeth as they pass in rotation, or something similar. Not much current involved, and unless the actual connectors fail to make proper contact, or the CPS/leads get damaged as the VP-44 is being replaced, nothing much to fail.

The original VP-44 was returned to II to have ONLY the out of spec parts replaced, turns out mine was one of Bosch's infamous design errors, where they used a brass advance cylinder liner. Those have proven to fail early to accelerated wear - just as mine did - the rebuilders now use a new outer case that employs a steel advance cylinder liner. Other than that, all the rest of the internals were fine, and reinstalled - that pump is now my spare...

Willys · 05-20-2007, 11:23 PM

Gary- I think your thread might be hitting on something here though. A friend and I have been working on his truck- it has the dreaded 216 code. After talking to a well known local diesel guru(and a scan), he determined it was the crankshaft position sensor. I replaced it yesterday and the truck is running well again. (I posted more details in a thread a month or two back) I'll have my friend check the codes again this week and see if the 216 code has disappeared. So far though, its working.

Gary - K7GLD · 05-20-2007, 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Willys

Gary- I think your thread might be hitting on something here though. A friend and I have been working on his truck- it has the dreaded 216 code. After talking to a well known local diesel guru(and a scan), he determined it was the crankshaft position sensor. I replaced it yesterday and the truck is running well again. (I posted more details in a thread a month or two back) I'll have my friend check the codes again this week and see if the 216 code has disappeared. So far though, its working.

Never can tell - keep us posted!

rweis · 12-11-2007, 05:05 PM

Am I correct in that if the Camshaft Position Sensor is totally dead (broken wire) the truck will not start or run?

Bob Weis